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How online ratings make good schools look bad

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GreatSchools is America’s biggest school ratings website. But what do its scores actually measure?
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When parents are researching where to move, they typically look at the quality of a neighborhood's schools. But good data on that is hard to find. That's where a website called GreatSchools has thrived. GreatSchools rates almost every public school in America on a scale of 1 to 10. But when we analyzed those ratings, we found that they almost never give high scores to schools in poor neighborhoods - even though data from their own website shows that many of those schools do a good job teaching students.
This video is a collaboration with Chalkbeat, an education news site. To read more about GreatSchools' ratings, read their story here: www.chalkbeat.org/posts/us/2019/12/05/greatschools-ratings-poverty-race-segregation-housing
EdWeek reported on how GreatSchools changed its ratings system in 2017: www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2017/11/01/school-rating-site-greatschools-expands-its-measuring-stick.html
And recently, researchers have found that the GreatSchools ratings may even have an effect on housing prices, locking poor people out of more affluent neighborhoods: www.chalkbeat.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/Digitization_and_Divergence__Paper_-2.pdf
Vox.com is a news website that helps you cut through the noise and understand what's really driving the events in the headlines. Check out www.vox.com.
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5 Dez 2019

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Xenphaphy
Xenphaphy Vor 11 Tage
Although I agree with the viewpoint, this is mostly just a biproduct of education inequality in America. About growth scores, the end product is what mostly matters, because it doesn't matter how much you improve if at the end, it's different. Additionally, at the very beginning of the video, Vox brought up the fact that it's a factor in deciding where to live. And throughout the video, they increasingly prove that there is a correlation between neighborhoods and schools. (Again, education inequality) So, if that's the case, GreatSchools fulfills their purpose. I'm really not sure whether this video is meant to be about education inequality, which is a big problem, or how GreatSchools isn't so -- great.
Sara A.
Sara A. Vor 29 Tage
Just to play devils advocate here: does being around better students not also benefit a kid? I mean a nine year old is able to do multiplication, it's a good thing if the kids around them can do it too... But basically: all schools should be good (aka properly funded) and a 40 hour week should be enough to feed a family, giving parents a chance to actually take part in the childrens education
Mario Mendoza
Mario Mendoza Vor Monat
Of course, VOX won't mention discipline issues in the lower income schools.
Webkinz Gal
Webkinz Gal Vor 2 Monate
What matters is how they come out Not how much they learn If someone entered school A not knowing how to read a sentence, and comes out writing 5 paragraph essays, where if someone entered school B entered knowing how to write an OK paragraph and left knowing how to write a whole research paper, the truth is the one writing the research paper will go further. Also the stats are wrong because there and many kids who live in public housing (poor people) in wealthy towns, and come out just as successful as the kid who lives in a big house down the road. So yeah it’s about the school
Ben Z
Ben Z Vor 3 Monate
A school that is good at bringing a 1 student to a 3 isn’t necessarily equally capable of bringing a 8 student to a 10. Growth score isn’t one size fits all.
* be happy *
* be happy * Vor 4 Monate
some are true. my old school was 6/10, my new one is 10/10 and its pretty accurate, but you should never only base your school choice this way.
James The Piano Cat
James The Piano Cat Vor 4 Monate
It’s not only the grades that matter tho, the niceness of the school (e.g. playground) also matters alot
Gregory Brew
Gregory Brew Vor 4 Monate
There’s also more room for growth in areas that start off lower.
Gregory Brew
Gregory Brew Vor 4 Monate
Diversity helps the schools on niche.
SpeedyCord
SpeedyCord Vor 5 Monate
And here I am thinking that they'd rate them based on the actual school grounds, rooms, bathrooms, equipments, the school location (if distance isn't an issue), The teachers, other staff and other students (checking if they are depressed or if there are bullies) I didn't think Scores mattered as much smh.
Κώστας Ναυαρίνος
How about NOT RATING? Just sayin
SF BS
SF BS Vor 5 Monate
Parents : I want a good school School graders : ok what good quality of the school do you want, growth rate, proficiency, safety...? Parents : yes
Chua Li
Chua Li Vor 6 Monate
china would like to know your location.
Hello Turtle
Hello Turtle Vor 6 Monate
I would never send my kid to an urban poor neighborhood school
Robert Ridley
Robert Ridley Vor 6 Monate
I thought it was going to be about the us news rankings. I've never heard of greatschools.
Epic Brussel sprout
Epic Brussel sprout Vor 7 Monate
But what about what people actually think about the school the "goodness" of a school shouldn't only be measured by tests that is just how much schools can force you to remember stuff for a day. Schools should be rated on the amount of bullying the niceness of the teachers and overall learning environment not just retention
G Cool
G Cool Vor 7 Monate
America has failed its people since the country became independent
T Doge
T Doge Vor 7 Monate
How about this, lets improve low income neighborhoods so that all students are prepared to go to school, and thus meet proficiency.
yang li
yang li Vor 7 Monate
And we should notice that it is much harder to make improvement in exams when you have already had a higher score.
hugo 888
hugo 888 Vor 7 Monate
So many lies from VOX. I say not allow test scores from parents with no immigration status. This would prove VOX is wrong. Its not about rich or poor. Its about the culture.
Engineer Ahmed
Engineer Ahmed Vor 7 Monate
Following factors matter 90 % not discussed in this video 1. Student's genetic IQ 2. Matching teaching style with Student's preferred learning method eg I love structured & online learning & hate research 3. Direction for success guided by parents .....parents told me go STEM/Medical 4. Motivation to be high achiever 5. opportunity to express ie bullying free spaces 6.Choice of subjects & activities
Engineer Ahmed
Engineer Ahmed Vor 7 Monate
Lunar Wave, Only school has to do with factors 2,5 & 6 discussed in my post above..... Video discusses schools r rated by avg of all students' standardized test scores.... I've exposed the real factors that actually contribute to each student's standardized test scores, which collectively over all student make school's avg test score
Lunar Wave
Lunar Wave Vor 7 Monate
What does it have to do with a general school quality rating? All of the above are things that depend on the student not on the school.
Raffy
Raffy Vor 7 Monate
I am not entirely sure about the statement Asian are affluent since Im not from USA. Do Asian-American really have great access to resources especially for studies in America or they are just hardworking students especially with pressure from parents?
Phoebe HB
Phoebe HB Vor 7 Monate
Does America not have anything like Ofsted here in the UK?
mai palazzo
mai palazzo Vor 7 Monate
"...Kelley Williams-Bolar, of Akron, was sentenced in 2011 to serve 10 days in jail after using her father’s address to falsify residency for her two daughters, allowing them to enroll illegally in a school district that posted better student test scores than the district in which they actually lived..."
Fawz I
Fawz I Vor 7 Monate
In Britain it's really similar but it's normally white and Hispanic in Richer 'better' schools. On the other hand Black and Asian communities go to more rundown academies.
Bryan
Bryan Vor 7 Monate
I didn't know Bowen Yang was doing narration work.
RestoreSanityFear
RestoreSanityFear Vor 7 Monate
So much relevant content has been left out of this video like obviously how schools are funded from the towns and how growth does not scale linearly. No sources linked for anything referenced in the video. You can do better Vox.
Aelfy Carcini
Aelfy Carcini Vor 7 Monate
Shh... Keep this a secret, so low income students have better education than richest students.
Sam pellergrino
Sam pellergrino Vor 7 Monate
Jesus you just always have to speak about race or the video isn't viable?
tv92taylor
tv92taylor Vor 7 Monate
Correlation is NOT Causation More affluent families can provide more support for education. More affluent areas are more appealing for teachers and administrators.
Scojopo23
Scojopo23 Vor 7 Monate
My school has a 4/10, but the issue is it’s not the school. It’s the kids in it. They don’t care about school and it hurts the rating. Those who do care report a over average AP enrollment and test scores, along with many achievements!
Bugay Den
Bugay Den Vor 7 Monate
Remember... No matter what school you go to, the world isn’t in books! Weigh your options, take into account everything. Listen, thank them for their opinion, but don’t let it be your final decision.
Tony Zan
Tony Zan Vor 7 Monate
Pump money into the poor schools. Stop fight so many wars. Use that money on poor schools
astari djatmiko
astari djatmiko Vor 7 Monate
From my experience in Indonesia, the best schools have the smartest students. But it's because from the beginning the best schools accepted students with the highest national test score. Now the system's been changed. Students go to the nearest school from their home, this can reduce traffic jam too. But some people still can't adapt to this system.
G G
G G Vor 7 Monate
I don't care what school you go to, America's education system is failing behind the rest of the world anyways
FayeBlade
FayeBlade Vor 7 Monate
If the walls aren't made of gold, then its a 2.
Dainon McDuffie
Dainon McDuffie Vor 7 Monate
Living in a small rural county, I appreciate that my tax money goes to my community schools that my kids & grandkids will go to one day. I like to see a direct effect in my neighborhood instead of just handing more money to the state or feds & hoping they use it appropriately.
Nick Nomo
Nick Nomo Vor 7 Monate
I think this is very obvious... Smarter and more educated parents produce smarter and more educated children. I know we supposed to be judging the school, but lets be honest why people use the greatschools website. They are usually evaluating an area they plan to move into, and want to see what they are moving into. You want an area where the kids are smart and educated, because that means the people in the area are probably smart and educated. A bad school usually means its a bad area. I think if any parent relies on the school to educate their kid, they are putting too much faith in the school. My kid comes back from school, and I see the reading, writing and math activities... and they are just sub par... and everyone is following the same common core curriculum. I can spend an hour or two a day, for a month, with my kid and get more done than the school can in 9 months. So, the point is, when you have these kids that go into school and end up under performing, that means their parents didn't teach them a thing. That's a huge warning sign. The school and the area are "bad" because of the members of that district. You don't want your smart well educated kid going there.
doom2avatar
doom2avatar Vor 7 Monate
I don’t think the flaw is at all important in real life. The people who can check these ratings and make a choice on where to live to send their kids to public school are not poor. I knew Asian immigrant families who would move states and careers for a good school and they were def not moving to the slums.
Marius Piedallu van Wyk
So if I have a child that is below average, I should send them to schools with higher growth scores. But are those schools also good with children who are gifted? The question is, if the 100% is what is average, then will the child who is at 120% converge to 100% faster in low-income schools? I'm just asking since I've had the opportunity to send my child to a higher rated school, but have opted to what I actually think is a better lower-rated school... I'm still second-guessing myself. Either way, I will probably be very involved with their schooling regardless.
Howard Fung
Howard Fung Vor 7 Monate
The video also missed the security factor, richer and more affluent areas also tend to be safer from violence and such, which should be priority when considering schools
Ben Hyman
Ben Hyman Vor 7 Monate
That’s because Denver’s public school system is divided by districts which are divided by city and county. The neighborhoods with more funding are considered better schools to this rating system.
Owe Learn
Owe Learn Vor 7 Monate
2:46 Detroit smash~
K L
K L Vor 7 Monate
But again, the reason why schools in low-income neighborhoods have higher growth is probably because the students start at a level too low to go any lower. It's easier to grow from 10 to 50 than from 80 to 90. You can't say schools are better because10 to 50 is larger than 80 to 90.
Suyog Chandak
Suyog Chandak Vor 7 Monate
Wasn't this obvious?
Anne Traut
Anne Traut Vor 7 Monate
You're completely ignoring the most important factor- CULTURE. Asians and whites value education a lot more than blacks and hispanics. You can't force kids or their parent(s) to care about school or put in the effort. The schools that have the most support from parents and family members are going to be the ones that perform better. It's that simple. It's all about culture.
DefinitelyNotDan
DefinitelyNotDan Vor 7 Monate
We need racially segregated schools that are all equally funded in order to prove that we are all equal.
Brick Life
Brick Life Vor 7 Monate
no one goes to school because of playgrounds
Thomas Bui
Thomas Bui Vor 7 Monate
But if you have a high proficiency coming in, there is little room for growth. The school isn't subpar for low growth. It is still very good.
Cutz McOnions
Cutz McOnions Vor 7 Monate
you get inaccurate results like this vid when you focus too much on agenda rather than properly doing fair research.
DefinitelyNotDan
DefinitelyNotDan Vor 7 Monate
Cutz McOnions but doing real research and using science properly will reveal the truth and that can’t happen
Ana Pekec
Ana Pekec Vor 7 Monate
I feel like this video is showing causation instead of a correlation. Like the website that rates these schools isn't doing it specifically because of its demographics. It's showing a larger system issue with the USA as a whole.
Tobias Konowitz
Tobias Konowitz Vor 7 Monate
I’m not sure what you were expecting, this is how culture influences school, and it is culture, Asian students have always had higher test scores than the rest and it’s a known fact that blacks and Hispanics tend to have lower standardized test scores, it’s sad but true.
X Lo
X Lo Vor 7 Monate
Tobias Konowitz you cant disagree with facts 😂
Tobias Konowitz
Tobias Konowitz Vor 7 Monate
If anyone disagrees please, feel free to comment, I’m open to criticism.
TheGreenLantern4
TheGreenLantern4 Vor 7 Monate
So, more racism fixes past racism?
Kermit DaFrog
Kermit DaFrog Vor 7 Monate
Diversity doesn't work
Michael H.
Michael H. Vor 7 Monate
Maybe some kids are smarter than others.....some kids might also be taller than other kids.
Slopjaw Johnson
Slopjaw Johnson Vor 7 Monate
I truly feel sorry for anybody that takes this seriously.
The seeker
The seeker Vor 7 Monate
Wow who would have thought poor black and Hispanic people are less a academically proficient then rich white and Asia people... oh ya everybody for the last 1000 years.
LIZARD1582
LIZARD1582 Vor 7 Monate
"I'm racist"
White Leviathen
White Leviathen Vor 7 Monate
So because schools get a bad grade that is based on test scores is bad because it shows that African American and Hispanics are achieving less? Tests are tests, and just because whites and Asians are better at taking tests doesn't make it a bad system.
Camisado
Camisado Vor 7 Monate
The premise that the races are equal is wrong and it's why this diatribe is wrong. Whites and Asians perform better. That's it.
5%LowBattery
5%LowBattery Vor 7 Monate
Which Asians? 1/5 of Vietnamese-Americans don’t have a high school diploma and end up in low paying jobs. 40% if the Hmong Community have less than a high school degree. Which whites? Including the ones from the Appalachian mountain region?
CAG RangerSealNinja
CAG RangerSealNinja Vor 7 Monate
This video will give you cancer because.... REEEEEECISM
X Lo
X Lo Vor 7 Monate
I think you guys are proving another point lol... bell curve
Starius2
Starius2 Vor 7 Monate
can y'all look into the NFL and NBA?? they're not diverse either. MUST BE RACISM
uri argaman
uri argaman Vor 8 Monate
-higher level of the students ->The school is able to teach more complicated material, making it better - students graduate it with more knowledge. -it is way easier to improve from 6 to 8 than it is to improve from 8 to 10. Perhaps a more relevant way to measure growth is as percentages of the growth in relation to the missing points up to 10 (and then 6 to 8 and 8 to 9 will be worth the same) In the end it also depends on one's children's proficiency...
Johnny Blaze
Johnny Blaze Vor 8 Monate
Question to the people who wrote and narrated this video: what school would you send your children too?
CeltBear333
CeltBear333 Vor 8 Monate
I've been in mostly white schools in Canada and very diverse schools in Houston Tx, I watched at least 5 teachers have mental breakdowns in Houston ISD. Teachers do not want to teach unruly kids who haven't been disciplined properly so the least experienced teachers or the worst is what you'll find in poorer schools
Cyranek
Cyranek Vor 8 Monate
glad I went to a 10/10 school. look at me now.
Los Angeles
Los Angeles Vor 11 Tage
Cyranek you went to quail summit?
frdy fzbar
frdy fzbar Vor 7 Monate
lol
Libby's Crafting Corner
Lies, lies and more lies that's all vox is
Big Hatter
Big Hatter Vor 8 Monate
Only "reporters" without kids could think parents would choose a school based on the condition of the playground and not on how well the school does at educating the students on fundamental subjects.
Perplexeus
Perplexeus Vor 8 Monate
I am european and where I live equality of opportunities is not perfect, even though the differences between schools are small. So how difficult must it be for someone in the USA to ascend.
Jackson Turner
Jackson Turner Vor 8 Monate
Vox: never leaves links to there supposed *research* Me:hmmmm 🤔
Aidan Zuber
Aidan Zuber Vor 7 Monate
There’s an entire description with links to all research.
Nathan Levesque
Nathan Levesque Vor 7 Monate
You could click the 'show more' button
SlovesL
SlovesL Vor 8 Monate
How about allowing school choice America?
Raven Cole
Raven Cole Vor 8 Monate
How subscriber counts make bad channels look good.
BungyStudios
BungyStudios Vor 7 Monate
How super rich media groups are using sub bots.
Logan Campbell
Logan Campbell Vor 8 Monate
Both.
A. A
A. A Vor 8 Monate
3:17 whaat?
Adolf Shitler
Adolf Shitler Vor 8 Monate
Wait, a school got a 7 in Detroit of all places. Lol thats impressive.
Jackson Kuzmic
Jackson Kuzmic Vor 8 Monate
My school says 6 for greatschools rating but 9 for growth and is in a while and Asian atea
555 444
555 444 Vor 8 Monate
I love how, no matter what subject the video is on, Vox can fit race baiting in it.
Soggy Herman
Soggy Herman Vor 8 Monate
How is this surprising?
sunflower subliminals
Once I saw this 1 star review of a school and the comment was just ‘there were too many good reviews so here’s a bad one lol for no reason’
Christopher Yiwei Liang
But schools with higher proficiency have smarter students and that might be important to many people.
lunayen
lunayen Vor 8 Monate
Higher proficiency doesn't always mean smarter students. Just more students who can afford tutoring.
Candace Jones-Radtke
Wow this is really great info. Can't wait to watch this again with my family.
sharpshiell
sharpshiell Vor 7 Monate
cancer
Joël Fortin
Joël Fortin Vor 8 Monate
I hate rich people
Maxi V
Maxi V Vor 8 Monate
also, some schools have a big population of immigrants who don’t speak english and then they’re forced to take these big tests in a language they don’t know and the scores end up reflecting badly for the school when really it’s not that the school is bad, it’s just that that school has to do ten times more when teaching it’s students. Letting schools be defined by test scores is so unfair and doesn’t take into account anything but a students test-taking abilities.
omikujiri_kukki
omikujiri_kukki Vor 8 Monate
According to my primary school, it's a 5 star
banana smoothie
banana smoothie Vor 8 Monate
USA not that big smart
Jerry Rupprecht
Jerry Rupprecht Vor 8 Monate
Well obviously if you want your child to go to a better school then you’re going to take them to a better funded one. If you send your child to a poor school then they’re probably not going to do as well.
Tomas Novotny
Tomas Novotny Vor 8 Monate
I dont care where are you from your grade is your fault and how much you study
Brother Husky
Brother Husky Vor 8 Monate
Just a question, what do you mean by "more black and Hispanic" Is it like 50% or more Black/Hispanic or what?
lunayen
lunayen Vor 8 Monate
Either black and/or Hispanic. A school can have a 30/60, 20/80 or practically all black or Hispanic student body. One thing is certain, the amount of white and Asians students is
Anika Basa Meldion Simamora
all the things they explain in this video, is just fact finding, they are not take a statistical test about their hypothesis. I think they should do at least a correlation and regression test.
yokemhard
yokemhard Vor 8 Monate
God bless being white
Son Patriot
Son Patriot Vor 8 Monate
Another thing this video misses is that better prep students seem to have less problems at school, while kids less prepared may have issues even before they come to school. Environment in school is really important, if all of your friends are bad, you will be too.
Thebluegamer 7208
Thebluegamer 7208 Vor 8 Monate
My school has a 3:(
dj
dj Vor 8 Monate
I searched up my school, was 10/10
The Road to Cosplay and Comic Con
The better the neighborhood the better the school
dnsbrules
dnsbrules Vor 8 Monate
The one based on white/Asian makes sense cause the Asians are smart. They also help their friends improve.
Rohan
Rohan Vor 8 Monate
Growth score has its merit but should not be higher than proficiency. Even if a school has an equivalent education quality, taking someone in who is at 20% and raising them to 50% is a growth of 30% but is an easier gap to cross than between say 80% and 90% because the amount of marginal change that has to be done from 80% to 90% is much more difficult. Not to mention, the wealthy neighborhoods pay more money in local taxes increasing the funding for the schools and by proxy making the schools have more resources. Wealthy neighborhoods tend to have better schools and this is not necessarily fair or even remotely indicative that the students are smarter- but the schools themselves have many benefits that other regions are sadly unable to access. Overall, increasing funding for schools in lower income neighborhoods will help change these statistics, as the issue is not likely to be just the way the data is collected
Olivia Wenya
Olivia Wenya Vor 8 Monate
Basing it solely on the growth score would naturally limit the schools where the students come better prepared if, they get 90/100 in a test the maximum they could improve would be the last 10 points or go beyond the curriculum which wouldn't be rewarded. While a school where the students initially score 10 or something would have a lot more room for improvement, and that school can get up to 90 points in the growth score. IDK and really don't care how Great schools balance it with the proficiency, but I think it's great they take other factors into account. The best method to calculate the score the school receive based on my personal opinion is to let the parent decided how much they want each factor to weigh.
Jasper Geary
Jasper Geary Vor 8 Monate
You should see the reviews of shore. School in Sydney
cczz0103
cczz0103 Vor 8 Monate
There goes vox again with the race card
Aukusti Valli
Aukusti Valli Vor 8 Monate
I'm glad about that I live in Finland.
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